Gaddafi: Stop Killing Your Own People


hillary clinton twn agenda.jpgSecretary of State Hillary Clinton has today released the statement below on Libya where things are getting worse.
Here is the Libya twitter feed; the government is reportedly bombing citizens from the air in Tripoli and elsewhere.

Situation in Libya

The world is watching the situation in Libya with alarm. We join the international community in strongly condemning the violence in Libya. Our thoughts and prayers are with those whose lives have been lost, and with their loved ones. The government of Libya has a responsibility to respect the universal rights of the people, including the right to free expression and assembly.
Now is the time to stop this unacceptable bloodshed. We are working urgently with friends and partners around the world to convey this message to the Libyan government.

I just heard the Libyan Ambassador to the United States Ali Aujali bravely and succinctly condemn his own government for what is happening. Libyan diplomats posted at Embassies and Missions around the world, to the United Nations, and to the Arab League are resigning their posts. Some parts of Libya’s military are standing down and defecting.
Gaddafi used to seem like a bumbling lunatic to most whose experience with him was limited to watching him speak at UN General Assembly sessions — but inside Libya, his control was firm and severe. That’s over now — and he and his retainers seem intent on destroying a country that they must know that they can never lead again.
— Steve Clemons


19 comments on “Gaddafi: Stop Killing Your Own People

  1. Kathleen says:

    A note from the rest of the world to the U.S. stop invading other nations based on “packs of lies” and killing, injuring hundreds of thousands and displacing millions. Stop killing innnocent people with U.S. drones. And stop supporting Israel’s ongoing expansion of illegal settlements.


  2. questions says:

    Everything at Warroom/Salon is worth reading this morning (yesterday’s posts).
    This one:
    This one:
    This one is hilarious:
    And this one:
    And this one too:
    The URLs give a pretty good idea of what’s what. The history of legislator walkouts and the reason that they aren’t super common is worthy of reading. And the likelihood of Walker’s WAY WAY overreaching is worth noting. He’s right up there with the crazy dictators who don’t bother listening to the people protesting because he’s pretty thoroughly convinced by his own rhetoric and position. It’s not a great political corner to have backed yourself into, and he’s going to have to find an exit. Considering that the last time Walker dumped union personnel (in Milwaukee, guarding court houses) a court undid his unilateral decree and force fines and back wages… one gets the feeling he just can’t stop himself.
    As Brad DeLong says, we need a better press corps. People with this personality trait should be vetted by the press BEFORE the election and it should be quite clear that unilateral anti-worker measures are the candidate’s preference. Maybe then anyone who is a worker might think twice about his or her vote???
    The gulf between the US Chamber and local chambers of commerce is vast. Publicize it more. Make it just as bad to take money from the CoC as it is to take if from any other profoundly sectarian, narrowly interested group. I can think of lots of parallels! And their money can be made to seem tainted. 16 companies proved nearly half of the CoC’s funding. This ain’t small business or mom and pop ops.
    And the Beck/Reform Judaism is radical thing is just bizarre. It’s radical to do services in English, not keep kosher, work on the Sabbath, not bother with candles and 9/10 of the holidays, go to the grandparents for Passover and have a sandwich before you get in….. THAT’S akin to “radicalized Islam”??????????????
    I hope he loses another 20% of his audience this week…. There simply must be a burnout factor with this kind of idiocy. Mustn’t there be?


  3. questions says:

    OT again!
    This one just deserves a click — a kos diary noting that some NYT article on Michele Bachmann quoted “one person on a blog” who turns out to have been a single anonymous commenter on a blog. The single, anonymous commenter made several typos and one word omission. The NYT corrected the mistakes.
    This is the news that’s fit to print???!
    As Brad DeLong might say, “We need a better press corps.”
    Everything up on Rortybomb today is good, including the linkdump….
    I now think that every blog should have a link dump that links to other blogs such that all blogs end up being linked to one another so that you could click your way through the entire blogosphere in an afternoon.
    I have other thoughts as well. Some of them involve Arne Duncan. Others, Gov Walker, and Gaddafi. I don’t think I have to type up these thoughts anymore.


  4. DonS says:

    “To follow up on Wisconsin, the Indiana gov Daniels and the Fla Gov Scott are positioning themselves against Walker in Wisc.” (questions)
    I don’t think Daniels is opposing Walker; on the Diane Rehm show he made it clear that he approves of dismantling unions and implementing “right to work” status since, he thinks, it’s worked so well elsewhere (e.g., North Carolina, Virgina). He sounds reasonable, but let’s remember he is a very slick politician/ex OMB head. My guess, his move(s) are strictly strategic as is this whole charade that is being played out in Republican governed states. Not that the deficits aren’t real, but that there is an effort to run them up further with cuts in corporate taxes, and then play the whole us-against-them game to crush to social services/safety net.
    Perhaps Daniels has just observed that the polls are running pretty badly against Walker, and is pulling back to regroup.


  5. questions says:

    And from TPM, regarding what Walker is up against (and perhaps much of the immoderate Tea Party)
    That AFL-CIO sponsored poll released this morning suggested that Gov. Walker (R) was definitely on the wrong side of public opinion in the state. But that’s a poll sponsored by one of the players in the fight. But now there’s a nationwide poll out from USAToday/Gallup that says that 61% of Americans oppose the kind of attacks on public employees unions that Walker is putting. That’s nationwide. Frankly, I’m a bit surprised it’s that high, though I would have expected it to be in the majority.
    Immoderation isn’t beloved for long by many.


  6. questions says:

    To follow up on Wisconsin, the Indiana gov Daniels and the Fla Gov Scott are positioning themselves against Walker in Wisc.
    Scott says collective bargaining is fine, and Daniels wants the right to work bill pulled from the state legislature and refuses to send the police after the fleeing dems.
    Who are the grown ups on the right?!
    Will the Tea Party tolerate any pragmatism at all, or do they really only settle for the US equivalent of thugocracy (a mild form, let’s face it)?
    all from various live updates at HuffPo


  7. Paul Norheim says:

    “I doubt that well-informed Muslims everywhere will be
    impressed by Clinton’s hypocritical sanctimony.”
    In the bizarre and scary scenario we’re witnessing right
    now- with a paranoid “leader of the revolution” completely
    detached from reality, barking out threats against his own
    people for more than an hour – in this situation I’m afraid
    “well-informed Muslims everywhere” are as irrelevant as a
    game of chess in Moscow or a philosophical congress in
    Hillary Clinton’s statement have absolutely no impact on
    the situation. We’re talking about a mad and desperate old
    man here, with a lot of destructive instruments at his
    disposal; and Clinton’s speech is as detached from *that*
    reality as Gaddafi is detached from the realities in his own
    This is not about US hypocrisy (a well known fact); this is
    about something horrible taking place in Libya right now.
    And “informed muslims” have very little influence on the
    events. What is important, is what those in the army and
    other powerful players supporting Gaddafi will do now –
    will they defect, or will they follow their leader in this
    spiral of violence and destruction?
    In this respect, John Kerry’s statement today was more in
    touch with the realities.
    And BTW: the hypocrisy of European countries is much
    more relevant in the Libyan case than US ditto. It’s their
    trade and their security that is at stake here. The US is
    currently not more important for Libya than China or India.


  8. Don Bacon says:

    Clinton: “The government of Libya has a responsibility to respect the universal rights of the people, including the right to free expression and assembly. Now is the time to stop this unacceptable bloodshed.”
    I doubt that well-informed Muslims everywhere will be impressed by Clinton’s hypocritical sanctimony. Coming from a country which has supported their tyrannical leaders who in turn have supported the bogus US war on terror, causing not only significant bloodshed but also torture, her preaching is certain to bring ridicule.


  9. questions says:

    Regime durability, regime longevity — not the same thing. Other characteristics of regimes and overthrows detailed. Really interesting:
    And union membership and budget issues, a preliminary look, with early data as opposed to maybe the best data, all preliminary, the comments have some links and thoughts as well:
    My best guess is that unwillingness to tax is a bigger problem than is the pension thing. And the biggest problem of all is likely the kind of odd resentments we pile on when we decide that rather than our all being together on a journey up, we feel individually like we’re falling down and we’re damned well gonna drag the lazy bastards down with us…..
    (kos has a diary up that details what a teacher would earn if each of 30 students paid an hourly wage of 3 bucks to the teacher for 180 days of full day instruction, no planning periods or prep time included…..
    Hope the multi link thing now works…..)


  10. questions says:

    Anyone catch this one, from Rortybomb, but noted in several places at this point….
    This text is from the Wisconsin bill that the Dems have fled from:
    ” 16.896 Sale or contractual operation of state?owned heating, cooling, and power plants. (1) Notwithstanding ss. 13.48 (14) (am) and 16.705 (1), the department may sell any state?owned heating, cooling, and power plant or may contract with a private entity for the operation of any such plant, with or without solicitation of bids, for any amount that the department determines to be in the best interest of the state. Notwithstanding ss. 196.49 and 196.80, no approval or certification of the public service commission is necessary for a public utility to purchase, or contract for the operation of, such a plant, and any such purchase is considered to be in the public interest and to comply with the criteria for certification of a project under s. 196.49 (3) (b).
    The bill would allow for the selling of state-owned heating/cooling/power plants without bids and without concern for the legally-defined public interest. ”
    There is other material around that suggests a pretty strong tie between the Kochtopus and Walker, and Walker and asset sales, and asset sales with no competitive bids to the Kochtopus.
    Now, I’m not conspiracy minded, and I do indeed think that the election in WI is free and fair and that there are some very interesting tensions between free and fair elections and the subversion of the majority in WI. And we do need to figure out what it means to reverse elections with odd procedures like fleeing from quorums rather than from recalls or the next election 2 years later.
    There are, indeed, legitimate questions to be asked.
    And I’m still convinced that interest group/donor pressure requires a lot more than mere money relations. The people of Wisconsin did indeed vote in an overwhelmingly large Republican contingent. It isn’t that they were suffering from an overdose of the Kochtopus…. And the legislators who support this legislative union busting will indeed face reelection eventually and they will be praised or damned, reelected or dumped.
    So I do really want to be careful here.
    BUT, it’s pretty interesting that there are strong ties between the billionaire boys’ club, the position papers all over the place on the public union/state budget/pension and benefit woes, Koch (oil and paper) and the gov of Wisconsin, and union busting, and selling off of state energy plants under no-bid, no-fuss, no-muss conditions.
    We ought to be front-paging this stuff and looking very carefully at the dynamics here. And we should really think about this whole billionaire thing. It’s getting a little old to have enormously wealthy people trying to buy up sectors of our lives, control them, monetize them, and make it all the harder for us to cope. And meanwhile, they cut taxes….
    and from kos:


  11. questions says:

    Weird glitch — the post shows up on the front page, but not under the story when I click to read the comments.


  12. Cee says:

    We all need a good laugh.
    President Shimon Peres addressed the riots in Libya during his visit to Spain, noting that he heard “Gaddafi’s speech two weeks ago, in which he said he prefers a Middle East without the State of Israel. Today we might reach a situation where there is a Libya, but without Gaddafi.”
    Peres won’t be happy about living next door


  13. JohnH says:

    Ah, Hillary the Horrible: “Now is the time to stop this unacceptable bloodshed.”
    Pray tell, where was Hillary on Iraq? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Oh, I know, it’s OK if you kill OTHERS. But you dare not kill your own people!
    In that regard, is Hillary suggesting that Libya should become more like the US?


  14. questions says:

    LA Times:
    “Reporting from Washington and Los Angeles


  15. Cee says:

    If the people want Qaddafi out, I wish them luck. However, because we have lied so much about Libya I don’t know who is killing whom.
    The endgame came down to damage limitation,” said the former CIA officer Robert Baer, who took part in the original investigation, “because the evidence amassed by [Megrahi’s] appeal is explosive and extremely damning to the system of justice.” New witnesses would show that it was impossible for Megrahi to have bought clothes that were found in the wreckage of the Pan Am aircraft – he was convicted on the word of a Maltese shopowner who claimed to have sold him the clothes, then gave a false description of him in 19 separate statements and even failed to recognise him in the courtroom.The new evidence would have shown that a fragment of a circuit board and bomb timer, “discovered” in the Scottish countryside and said to have been in Megrahi’s suitcase, was probably a plant.
    The B.B.C.’s investigation, “Twelve Minutes Over Tripoli,” aired on B.B.C.-1 T.V. on April 3, 1987. For a summary of some of its findings, see Bill Schaap, “The Endless Campaign: Disinforming the World on Libya,” Covert Action Information Bulletin, No. 30, Summer 1988, pp. 70-71.
    An excerpt:
    Not only was there no evidence of Libyan involvement, there was considerable evidence to the contrary. Every Western European government except Mrs. Thatcher’s — which would support President Reagan if he said the sun rose in the west — expressed skepticism, as did the West Berlin police authorities in charge of the investigation.
    In fact, U.S. Ambassador Burt, Secretary of State Shultz, and Secretary of Defense Weinberger all lied to bolster the story that the U.S. had clear proof of Libyan involvement. They said that the U.S. evidence — intercepts of coded messages between Libyan People’s Bureaus — was so compelling that prior to the bombing U.S. military police in West Berlin had been put on the alert and had been clearing bars of customers that evening. Weinberger went so far as to say that the M.P.s were just fifteen minutes late to save the people at the LaBelle discotheque. In fact, this was a complete fabrication. As the Deputy Chief of West Berlin’s military police told Bower, there was no alert, no one was going around clearing bars, and it would not have made any sense in the first place, since the intercepts made no mention of specific targets.
    Fifteen years after the Berlin disco bombing, a German judge convicted four people, including a Libyan embassy worker and diplomat, of the crime and imposed 12 to 14 year sentences. The judge concluded that Qaddafi’s personal responsibility was not proven.
    For later stories about other suspects in the disco bombing, see for example, Robert J. McCartney, “Clues Hint Syrian Link In ’86 Berlin Bombing,” Washington Post, January 11, 1988, p. A13. An excerpt:
    New clues have surfaced suggesting that the 1986 bombing of a West Berlin discotheque may have been ordered by a convicted Arab terrorist who has been linked by a court to Syrian officials in another bombing case, a West Berlin court spokesman said today. . . .
    [A] U.S. official familiar with the case acknowledged that the revelations “may raise some questions about who was sponsoring what.” The U.S. government has not altered its judgment that Libya was “involved” in the La Belle bombing, said the official, who spoke on condition that he not be identified. “We’re still sticking to our original notion that the Libyans were involved in this thing, regardless of who else this woman may be tied in with,” the U.S. official said.
    “A Plan to Overthrow Kaddafi,” Newsweek, August 3, 1981, p. 19. An excerpt:
    The details of the plan were sketchy, but it seemed to be a classic C.I.A. destabilization campaign. One element was a “disinformation” program designed to embarrass Kaddafi and his government. Another was the creation of a “counter government” to challenge his claim to national leadership. A third — potentially the most risky — was an escalating paramilitary campaign, probably by disaffected Libyan nationals, to blow up bridges, conduct small-scale guerrilla operations and demonstrate that Kaddafi was opposed by an indigenous political force.
    For a later exposure of some of the U.S. government’s disinformation campaigns, see Jonathan Alter, “A Bodyguard of Lies,” Newsweek, October 13, 1986, p. 43.
    [I]n August national-security adviser John Poindexter sent President Reagan a memo outlining what Poindexter called a “disinformation program” aimed at destabilizing Libyan leader Muammar Kaddafi by generating false reports that the United States and Libya were again on a collision course. . . . . [The lies] were profoundly disturbing, even to journalists hardened by a lifetime of covering dissembling officials.


  16. DonS says:

    My understanding from listening to an expert on Libya is that there is no organized opposition of any sort. This situation would seem to call for bold UN action although to my knowledge no such mechanism exists. Still, with Libyan diplomats resigning, and the nation apparently in the grips of a reactive gang of thugs, some emergency measures would seem to be called for. With the oil wealth in Libya it is difficult to imagine the debacle simply being ignored.


  17. questions says:

    “Members of Libya


  18. questions says:

    “Hundreds of Qaddafi supporters took over Green Square after truck loads of militiamen arrived and opened fire on protesters, scattering them from the square. Residents said they now feared even to emerge from their houses.


Add your comment

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *