Gaddafi Defiant


Moammar Gaddafi:

I will not leave the country and I will die as a martyr.

I have no comment.
— Steve Clemons


23 comments on “Gaddafi Defiant

  1. Mohammad M says:

    It is not surprising to see Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi use any and all means, including the most savage violence, to hold onto power. Gaddafi even though under our pardon deal, after all, is a terrorist. Gaddafi is a known lunatic and a monster that we help create. Anyone who knows him know that he will not stop killing people or give up until he is taken out.
    Search his crime list and his pardon for attack on Pan Am 103 which he was granted unofficially as part of the deal. Why? for keeping “Strategic Equation” in the region. I thought we do not negotiate with Terrorists?


  2. Zafar Khan says:

    The sooner someone makes his martyrdom wish come
    true the better it will be for humanity.


  3. Cee says:

    Good news!!! I hope the voters remember the comments of Walker.
    From Raw Story:
    Governor’s official phone line goes down: ‘The number you dialed is not a working number’
    Update: Walker’s office says call was real
    Second update (at bottom): Watchdog calls for probe on possible ethics violation
    Prepare for prankgate.
    Wisconsin’s newly elected Republican Governor wasted no time in taking the fight to public sector unions, but union supporters and the alternative press have spared no expense firing back.
    But now, a hay-maker has been thrown.
    An alternative paper in Buffalo, New York, which prides itself on being about as beastly as the subjects they cover, managed to trick Governor Scott Walker into taking a call from their editor posing as tea party tycoon David Koch.
    The transcript isn’t pretty. It’s also unclear whether it was real, but efforts to contact Walker’s office proved futile Wednesday morning. While the governor’s official phone line — at (608) 266-1212 — was returning busy signals for a time, it had reverted to an automated error message by 11 am EST.
    “The number you dialed is not a working number. Please check the number and dial again.”
    While the Buffalo Beast’s website went down almost immediately after their story was posted, likely due to a torrent of web traffic, bloggers far and wide seized upon the story and were sharing bits of the text by Wednesday morning.
    A few highlights included the alleged governor warning the phony oil baron that Wisconsin House Rep. Tim Cullen, a Democrat who’s voted with Republicans on numerous issues, was “not one of us;” Walker supposedly commenting that he’s “got the layoff notices ready” and bragging that he’s got a baseball bat with his name on it; and accepting an offer to be flown out to California for “a good time.”
    The call also allegedly reveals that Wisconsin Republicans are planning to hold Democrats’ paychecks hostage by changing the rules to end direct deposit, placing their printed checks in their desks on the floor of the senate, forcing them to physically come in to pick them up.
    The voice alleged to be Walker also said he was trying to find ways to prosecute Wisconsin Democrats on ethical violations if they accepted favors from union organizers.
    Moments later in the call recording, Walker allegedly accepts an offer for similar favors from the fake Koch.
    Charles and David Koch, two key financiers of the Republican tea parties, were also major financiers of Walker’s bid for the Wisconsin governor’s office. Their political action committee gave Walker roughly $100,000 in campaign contributions during the 2010 election, according to campaign finance records highlighted by Mother Jones.


  4. questions says:

    The guy, Ass’t AG Jeff Cox, lost his job quickly and cleanly. The AG fired him according to a front page kos story.
    As it should be.


  5. Cee says:

    Gaddhafi? Nope. A Gov. Walker supporter.
    “Use live ammunition,” a Twitter user named JCCentCom replied.
    When confronted, the Twitter user stood by his words, insisting that the protesters were “political enemies” and “thugs.”
    “[A]gainst thugs physically threatening legally-elected state legislators & governor? You’re damn right I advocate deadly force,” he wrote.
    Mother Jones’ Adam Weinstein later discovered that JCCentCom was a deputy attorney general at the Office of the Indiana Attorney General.


  6. Paul Norheim says:

    “In light of how recently Freeman expounded on the
    Chinese democracy demonstrators, is it unreasonable to
    wonder what he might think if similar demonstrations
    broke out in Saudi Arabia?”
    Sorry WigWag – I’ve read your other Freeman-posts, and
    forgot that his view was expressed in an email. No, it isn’t
    “unreasonable to wonder…”
    I do, however, find it hard to understand why you so
    frequently use the unfolding drama in the Middle East,
    historic events of major significance, as a backdrop for
    scoring petty points against your pet adversaries. You have
    plenty of historic knowledge, and have sometimes shown
    yourself as well versed in strategic thinking (although I
    must admit that I often think you get it wrong). Why not
    try to apply some geopolitical thinking to the seismic
    shifts in the Middle East?
    The picture is chaotic, and the future is unpredictable, but
    it would be far more interesting to speculate on the
    possible impact on the region, than reading your habitual
    rants against the usual suspects.
    Do you think that this may spread to Iran in the near
    future, with a regime change as the final outcome? I find it
    more likely than unlikely. How may that influence the
    chain of ideological, moral and military support going
    from Iran via Syria to Hizbollah and Hamas?
    Do you think the revolt will spread to Syria? (I wouldn’t be
    surprised). And we know that it has already spread to
    Jordan. What about the Kurds in the region? Realities are
    changing very fast right now – some for the better, some
    for the worse, probably. We can only speculate, but isn’t
    this kind of speculation much more fascinating than the
    possible mistakes of Freeman, Walt, et al?


  7. WigWag says:

    “WigWag, we’ve taken your point about Freeman’s take on China more than 20 years ago.” (Paul Norheim)
    With all due respect, Paul, your suggestion that Freeman’s take on the Tiananmen Square massacre is more than 20 years old is in error.
    It is true that the Tiananmen Square massacre occurred in 1989, but that was in the era before email was in widespread use. In fact, the email that Freeman sent excoriating the Chinese for their tepid response to the student’s demonstrating for freedom in Beijing was authored by Freeman on May 26, 2006 and sent from his home email account at 9:29 pm.
    This means that the views that Freeman expressed about the Tiananmen Square affair are not more than 20 years old, they are less than 5 years old. At the time that Obama was planning to invite Freeman into his administration, Freeman’s views as expressed in his email were only two years old.
    In light of how recently Freeman expounded on the Chinese democracy demonstrators, is it unreasonable to wonder what he might think if similar demonstrations broke out in Saudi Arabia? After all, Steve invites Freeman to post at his website with some degree of regularity and he invited Freeman (as well as Steve Walt) to sign his letter on the U.N. Resolutions on Israeli settlements.
    It seems to me that my comments about Freeman are both timely, relevant and entirely on topic.


  8. WigWag says:

    “No, not all violence is the same.” (Nadine)
    I’m afraid that you’re right, Nadine, but in fairness to Chas Freeman, he’s not the only realist commentator who likes to make excuses for brutal Arab dictators. The voluable Steve Walt has a penchant for doing the same thing.
    In fact, it was only about a year ago (January 19, 2010) when Professor Walt was practically waxing eloquent about what a nice place he found Libya to be. If there was anything nasty to be said about Colonial Gadaffi, Walt couldn’t figure out what it might be.
    Here’s what the good professor had to say in a post on his blog that he affectionately entitled,
    “The Shores of Tripoli.”
    “…although Libya is far from a democracy, it also doesn’t feel like other police states that I have visited. I caught no whiff of an omnipresent security service — which is not to say that they aren’t there — and there were fewer police or military personnel on the streets than one saw in Franco’s Spain. The Libyans with whom I spoke were open and candid and gave no sign of being worried about being overheard or reported or anything like that. The TV in my hotel room featured 50+ channels, including all the normal news services (BBC World Service, CNN, MSNBC, Bloomberg, Al Jazeera, etc.) along with contemporary U.S. sitcoms like “2-1/2 Men,” shows like “Desperate Housewives,” assorted movies, and one of the various “CSI” clones. A colleague on the trip told me that many ordinary Libyans have satellite dishes and that the government doesn’t interfere with transmissions. I tried visiting various political websites from my hotel room and had no problems, although other human rights groups report that Libya does engage in selective filtering of some political websites critical of the regime. It is also a crime to criticize Qaddafi himself, the government’s past human rights record is disturbing at best, and the press in Libya is almost entirely government-controlled. Nonetheless, Libya appears to be more open than contemporary Iran or China and the overall atmosphere seemed far less oppressive than most places I visited in the old Warsaw Pact.”
    For the whole post, go here,
    Today, exactly 399 days from the time he wrote his previous post on Libya, Walt had this to say,
    “…Qaddafi’s brutal, narcissistic, and incoherent campaign of repression has been far more reprehensible than Mubarak’s.”
    The entire post can be found here,
    Perhaps Chas Freeman is right to maintain radio silence about his personal feelings about the uprising in Bahrain and whether the Saudis, if confronted with an uprising of their own, should recapitulate the tactics of the Chinese in Tiananmen Square. He’s learned the hard way that stupid emails can come back to haunt you.
    My guess is that it hasn’t occurred to Professor Walt that stupid blog posts can also come back to haunt you. Or maybe it’s just that Walt has one thing that Freeman doesn’t have–


  9. Paul Norheim says:

    “2138: The former British foreign secretary Lord Owen,
    tells the BBC’s Newshour that the situation is “a
    humanitarian disaster”. He believes the UN needs to
    mandate a resolution. “We can’t intervene on the ground,
    but we can stop Gaddafi threatening his own people with
    his air force.”” (BBC)
    I think Lord Owen has may have a point. If this is
    developing into a genocide, neither the UN nor the US nor
    the EU or the AU will react fast enough – if at all. We all
    remember the hesitation of the UN and the US under
    Annan/Albright/ Clinton to agree that what happened in
    Rwanda should be defined as a “genocide”.
    A genocide with machetes may take a month. Employing
    the air force, it may take days, hours. If Gaddafi’s speech
    was a prelude to a genocide, a no-fly-zone should be


  10. DonS says:

    Paul, I think you are going to have to get over it — Wig wag and nadine that is. Face it, they are going focus with venom on anything or anyone who taints or appears to taint their shining Israeli city on the hill. They will test that line, and seek to bait anyone, especially the host, in that cause. Tienamin means nothing to them; they would exterminate a few million Chinese themselves if it were to Israel’s advantage. The grudge they bear against Freeman is ostensibly, as you know, because of some ginned up anti-Semitism. Just the same sort of subhuman category they arrogantly relegate most of us here to. I personally feel grateful to be disapproved by their ilk.
    Until there is a “flag” button all we can do, except where a legitimate policy question is involved, is try to ignore their ignorance and poor judgment.


  11. Cee says:

    He has been hated ever since he nationalized the oil and became a founding member of OPEC. Am I wrong about this?
    Fill up your tank now.
    He and Mubarak have had to live looking over their shoulders and under their beds for years. Both are now somewhat unhinged.
    I can see Walker doing that since he has threatened to use the National Guard to end the protests. Also, a police organization said they WOULD use force on the union supporters.
    Is Engdahl right?
    The US Project for a ‘Greater Middle East’
    The spreading regime change operations Washington from Tunisia to Sudan, from Yemen to Egypt to Syria are best viewed in the context of a long-standing Pentagon and State Department strategy for the entire Islamic world from Kabul in Afghanistan to Rabat in Morocco.
    The rough outlines of the Washington strategy, based in part on their successful regime change operations in the former Warsaw Pact communist bloc of Eastern Europe, were drawn up by former Pentagon consultant and neo-conservative, Richard Perle and later Bush official Douglas Feith in a white paper they drew up for the then-new Israeli Likud regime of Benjamin Netanyahu in 1996.
    That policy recommendation was titled A Clean Break: A New Strategy for Securing the Realm. It was the first Washington think-tank paper to openly call for removing Saddam Hussein in Iraq, for an aggressive military stance toward the Palestinians, striking Syria and Syrian targets in Lebanon.[24] Reportedly, the Netanyahu government at that time buried the Perle-Feith report, as being far too risky.
    By the time of the events of September 11, 2001 and the return to Washington of the arch-warhawk neoconservatives around Perle and others, the Bush Administration put highest priority on an expanded version of the Perle-Feith paper, calling it their Greater Middle East Project. Feith was named Bush


  12. Paul Norheim says:

    I saw almost the entire speech, until Al Jazeera interrupted
    it ten minutes before it ended. I think it’s the most surreal
    and frightening speech I’ve ever heard.
    The immediate question is this: Is there any way to
    influence those of his supporters within the army etc.
    capable of implementing the mayhem he promised his
    enemies (i.e. the people)?
    Amnesty? Safe access to exile? Freezing bank accounts?
    The Hague? The genocide court in Arusha?
    Or will they fight to the bitter end no matter what people
    abroad say; and does his base still have the means to
    create mayhem?


  13. questions says:

    “For a second time, Colonel Qaddafi appeared on state television. Dressed in brown robes with a matching turban, he sometimes shouted and seemed to tremble with anger as he delivered a harangue that lasted some 73 minutes. His lectern was planted in the middle of the old wreckage of his two-story house in the Aziziyah barracks in Tripoli, a house American warplanes had destroyed in a 1986 air raid and which he has left as a monument to American perfidy.
    In the rambling, sometimes incoherent address, he said those challenging his government


  14. Paul Norheim says:

    we’ve taken your point about Freeman’s take on China
    more than 20 years ago. And everyone here knows that
    David Frum was responsible for the axis-of-evil speech
    some years ago. Many people here didn’t like that speech
    either. Steve Clemons embraces both Freeman & Frum,
    thinking (correctly) that both have some valuable insights
    once in a while, perhaps despite of former positions.
    I guess you and I just have to accept that Steve may be
    less sectarian, less partisan than most of us; and that this
    is one of the reasons why both you and I are allowed to
    post on the same forum – as long as we don’t call each
    other or our host assholes.
    Get over it, please.
    Anything interesting to say about Libya?


  15. Don Bacon says:

    The Libya situation has the potential to hit Americans (and Europeans) where it hurts — at the gas pump. Libya, unlike Egypt and others, is a member of OPEC. Would there be some relief from OPEC from a drop in Libya oil production? Any hope?
    The Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) held a meeting recently.
    news release:
    11 Dec 2010 | The 158th (Extraordinary) Meeting of the Conference of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) convened in Quito, Ecuador, on 11 December 2010, under the Chairmanship of its President, HE Wilson P


  16. Cee says:

    Seems like he’ll get his wish. The foreign intelligence services have wanted him dead for years. Perhaps many of Libyans want that as well.
    As I said before, I don’t believe all of the news stories coming out of there.
    In one instance, they showed Libyan helicopters that landed in Malta, then airplanes. Which was it?
    I still question who all of the snipers are.
    Any words on who is being chosen to take his place?


  17. WigWag says:

    Freeman Defiant?
    I hope that it is not indelicate to point out that there are currently three posts featured at the Washington Note criticizing the brutal behavior of the Gaddafi regime. The tactics that the Libyan dictator is using are precisely the same as were employed by the Chinese Communists during the Tiananmen Square uprising in 1989.
    According to the New York Times, a few hundred people have died in the current Libyan turmoil. Columnist Nick Kristof said about 800 Chinese were killed during the Tiananmen Square demonstrations; the International Red Cross put the toll at approximately 3,000.
    The Washington Note is also currently featuring a guest post by Chas Freeman, the man who criticized the Chinese regime for being too tepid in its response to the Tiananmen Square demonstrations. According to Freeman, the Chinese should have acted to put down the demonstrations more quickly and more vigorously. The inescapable conclusion is that Freeman believes (or at least once believed) that the tactics used by the Chinese in 1989 and, by extension, the Libyans today are, at the very least, acceptable.
    I suppose Steve is to be complimented for his open-mindedness. On the one hand he criticizes the brutal behavior of Gaddafi but on the other hand he invites a man who supported the same brutal behavior in 1989 to post on his blog.
    Does Freeman support what Gaddafi is doing in the same way that he supported the harsh crackdown on the Chinese students?
    Perhaps at some point he will decide to tell us.


  18. Ben Rosengart says:

    Forgive the frivolity, but … who’s copying whose style here?


  19. Paul Norheim says:

    A handful of tweets:
    “Analysts say that if mercenaries are defeated in Tripoli,
    regime will collapse. #Feb17 #Libya
    about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck
    Defected #Libya airforce captain to Aljazeera: Failed
    attempt on #Gaddafi’s life yesterday. #Feb17
    about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck
    Defected #Libya airforce captain to Aljazeera: Officers who
    refused to follow orders were shot dead. #Feb17
    about 3 hours ago via TweetDeck
    Defected #Libya airforce captain to Aljazeera: High ranking
    officers asked #Gaddafi to step down; replied he will give
    them “burnt land”.
    about 3 hours ago via TweetDeck”


  20. Paul Norheim says:

    He compared the situation with Falluja and Tien-An-Men;
    saying that the unity of China was more important than
    the people at Tien-An-Men.
    Now, the big question is: does he still have a base, people
    capable and willing to implement his threats? Or will his
    generals abandon him and try to save their own asses in
    the last moment? Again, I got a feeling of “Hitler’s last
    days”. Are there any “Albert Speers” around him, complicit
    in his crimes, but not mad or desperate enough to destroy
    what remains, not willing to massacre a people who
    “doesn’t deserve their leader” at a moment when they
    know that the game is over?
    Or was this just the surreal and scary prelude to a civil war
    or a genocide?


  21. non-hater says:

    He looks more like a member of the Stones than an aging dictator in that photo. Do I see a guitar strap on his right shoulder there?
    Anyway, good riddance in advance, for whenever and however he goes.


  22. Don Bacon says:

    It seems like yesterday:
    Time Magazine
    Why Gaddafi’s Now a Good Guy
    Tuesday, May 16, 2006
    . . .Gaddafi and Bush do apparently see eye to eye. On Monday, Gaddafi accomplished one of history’s great diplomatic turnarounds when Secretary of State Condeleezza Rice announced that the U.S. was restoring full diplomatic relations with Libya and held up the Great Socialist People’s Libyan Arab Jamahiriya as “a model” for others to follow.
    This was in spite of the 2006 US State Department Human Rights Report on Libya, March 6, 2007, which stated in part:
    The Great Socialist People’s Libyan Arab Jamahiriya is an authoritarian regime with a population of approximately six million, ruled by Colonel Mu’ammar Al Qadhafi since 1969. . .The government’s human rights record remained poor. Citizens did not have the right to change their government. Reported torture, arbitrary arrest, and incommunicado detention remained problems. The government restricted civil liberties and freedoms of speech, press, assembly, and association. The government did not fully protect the rights of migrants, asylum seekers, and refugees. . .//end
    This is a reason why these upheavals are not good news for a US foreign policy which has coddled tyrannical dictators.


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