Forum on Post-Partisan Foreign Policy

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This morning, from 9:00 am EST until 10:30 am, I will be chatting with journalist Elizabeth Becker and Mother Jones DC Bureau Chief David Corn on partisanship, journalism, and foreign policy.
The meeting is sponsored by the Conflict Prevention and Resolution Forum and Search for Common Ground.
More soon.
— Steve Clemons

Comments

47 comments on “Forum on Post-Partisan Foreign Policy

  1. ArtisRevolution says:

    FYI:
    Posted by PissedOffAmerican, Jan 14 2009, 11:43AM – Link
    He and his girlfriend are survivalists that pay no taxes and are stockpiling firewood and food rations for what they believe will be a total breakdown of society. This is why he argues in such a nasty manner and practically taunts other posters over the Israeli/Palestinian situation. He believes he is doing his part to hasten what he believes is a kind of hybrid end times. He’s a Ron Pauler with none of the subtlety. He also is prepared to “protect with force” his stash of firewood and freeze dried food.
    Trivia: His girlfriend calls him “Firestarter” or “burnout” one of the two
    all this information is from his own published ramblings on public sites on the internet

    Reply

  2. varanasi says:

    thanks for slap, arthur.
    let’s just say that i’m old enough to think you’re self-righteous and an ageist.
    and just for the sake of argument, what conclusions can we draw about an older man (like you) who stoops to the level of arguing online with people he feels are emotionally immature?

    Reply

  3. arthurdecco says:

    varanasi, Just how old are you? (Your chronological age – I’ve got a pretty good handle already on your emotional one.)

    Reply

  4. varanasi says:

    “I’m sure, if you were to send a private email message to Steve, he might just clue you in to a few of the Washington personalities that he knows follow his blog. Or perhaps not, I can’t speak for Steve.”
    POA: dare i say that following steve’s blog doesn’t mean reading these often pathetic comment threads. but you wouldn’t realize that because you’re so full of yourself. you actually think that you’re some kind of “featured player” around here and that steve’s success is in some way your own.
    believe it or not, many people around here don’t take you seriously. you’re a nusiance, like some kind of antagonistic and obscene wind-up doll.
    i usually scroll right past your paranoid and adolescent diatribes.
    but then again, maybe you really *are* getting to richard pearle! you go, mr. powerbroker, you ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Reply

  5. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Varanasi, I stated that when I call Frum, Perle, etc, a scumbag, liar, etc, that there is an odds on chance they might get the message. Is that a bit hopeful on my part? Perhaps, but oh well.
    I also commented that Steve’s blog has undoubtedly attracted the attention of both AIPAC and Hasbara.
    I’m sure, if you were to send a private email message to Steve, he might just clue you in to a few of the Washington personalities that he knows follow his blog. Or perhaps not, I can’t speak for Steve.
    But I can tell you, you irritating little pissant, that you are making a complete and utter asshole of yourself. Twisting what I said doesn’t exactly compliment your argument, nor does it say a whole lot for your integrity. So my advice to you would be just to shut the fuck up, because you obviously don’t know when to stop digging the hole you’ve buried yourself in.
    But hey, you don’t have to take my advice. Of course you can make as big an ass out of yourself as you want to. Heck, you might even set a record.

    Reply

  6. varanasi says:

    “Thats allright, varanasi, you don’t have to dignify me with a “serious response”. But, uh, you might wanna consider the myriad of other readers that are observing you make an ass of yourself.”
    oh, you mean all the “big players” that are reading these comment threads and having their minds blown by your expert analysis?
    oh well, i’ll leave the spotlight and acclaim to a real pro like you.
    but thanks for the advice, big shot ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Reply

  7. PissedOffAmerican says:

    “saying that iran has probably accelerated their nuclear weapons program is a somewhat controversial…..”
    Well, considering that that IS NOT what you said……
    “forgive me for not posting specific links that support my opinion, but i refuse to dignify POA with a serious response”
    Does anyone believe he can support his assertion? That links exist to support his assertion?
    “in respect to the findings of the last NIE, i took that report as more of a checkmate against cheney and other bush hawks rather than a full and accurate assesment of iranian intentions”
    Yeah, the Isrealis are telling us the truth, but our own intelligence agencies are lying. And lets just ignore the findings of the IAEA.
    Thats allright, varanasi, you don’t have to dignify me with a “serious response”. But, uh, you might wanna consider the myriad of other readers that are observing you make an ass of yourself.

    Reply

  8. varanasi says:

    paul:
    there is absolutely nothing to “get away” with.
    saying that iran has probably accelerated their nuclear weapons program is a somewhat controversial, but hardly irresponsible statement to make. there are many international experts who agree, including some of my colleagues who actually have some expertise in the field.
    forgive me for not posting specific links that support my opinion, but i refuse to dignify POA with a serious response. and what would the links prove anyways? clearly there are others who share my opinion and clearly someone like POA already his mind made up. in the end, none of us know the truth about the iranian nuclear program.
    in respect to the findings of the last NIE, i took that report as more of a checkmate against cheney and other bush hawks rather than a full and accurate assesment of iranian intentions.

    Reply

  9. Paul Norheim says:

    Regardless of who is reading or not reading TWN, you can`t just
    say anything and get away with it.

    Reply

  10. varanasi says:

    “To state otherwise is actually – propaganda, and highly irresponsible in the above mentioned context.”
    yeah. especially since the heavyweights of the washington ruling class are making policy decisions based upon reading your insightful posts and crack investigative reporting.
    keep up the great work, POA. you’re having a profound effect and your country’s leaders are depending upon you ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Reply

  11. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Meant to say “American sailors”…(Liberty)

    Reply

  12. Paul Norheim says:

    “you really believe that iran does not have an accelerated
    nuclear weapons program? wow.” (varanasi)
    “you’re always right POA, clearly iran has no interest in pursuing
    an atom bomb. never have. never will.” (varanasi)
    Well Varanasi, in the main context of this issue – i.e. USA
    considering until recently to bomb Iran and Israel still
    considering it, there is a huge difference between claiming that
    Iran “does (…) have an accelerated nuclear weapons program”
    and claiming that they may wish, or may have wished in the
    past, to “pursue an atom bomb”.
    Assumptions are not evidence, and no one have yet proven that
    Iran actually “have an accelerated nuclear weapons program”. To
    state otherwise is actually – propaganda, and highly
    irresponsible in the above mentioned context. Remember WMD
    and Iraq?

    Reply

  13. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Hmmmm, it went from Iran having an “accelerated nuclear weapons program” to Iran “having an interest in pursuing an atom bomb”.
    Varanasi, I’m assuming, logically, that most people seeing this post know how to read, and have read the rest of the posts on this thread. I don’t think I need to point out to them who is acting like a jackass on this thread.
    Now, care to revisit your comment about Iran having “an accelerated nuclear weapons program”?
    Or perhaps you will explain to me why my sentiments towards Israel should be fonder than my sentiments towards Iran, using your example of hostile action against us as a gauge by which we should “fear” them. It was bad to take American hostages, but not bad to kill American soldiers?
    Tell me, varanasi, are there currently any Iranian agents facing espionage trials in the United States?

    Reply

  14. varanasi says:

    *POA furiously pounds away on his keyboard trying to shout someone down and looking for links… always looking for links*
    you’re always right POA, clearly iran has no interest in pursuing an atom bomb. never have. never will.

    Reply

  15. PissedOffAmerican says:

    “i sense very little fear of iran on this board. i find this fact fascinating because it’s the same iranian leadership which stormed *your* embassy and kidnapped *your* embassy workers, right?”
    But we’re supposed to love Israel for the Liberty incident, and the espionage committed against us, right?
    And, care to link to your proof that Iran has “an accelerated nuclear weapons program?” The IAEA doesn’t believe this to be the case. You have information they don’t?
    Its comical, really, that our resident Indian gets his talking points right out of “The AIPAC Handbook of Unmittigated Horseshit”.
    I’m sure, in response to being asked for a link or source for his “accelerated nuclear weapons program” claim, he’ll stutter, and say, “Its all over the net”, as he does everytime he’s asked to collaborate his spew with something other than intellectual flatulence.

    Reply

  16. varanasi says:

    classic response from a 55 year old:
    “i know you are but what am i?”
    what’s next, “i am rubber, you are glue, whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you!”
    what time is recess over, POA?

    Reply

  17. Paul Norheim says:

    POA, this is very simple. You can`t make a friendly gesture with
    your right hand and a “fuck you” sign with your left, and pretend
    that the one you`re talking to has been given a “choice”.
    Communication doesn`t work that way.

    Reply

  18. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Obviously, varanasi has made his choice as well.
    Congrats, you two, you’re everything you claim I am.

    Reply

  19. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Like I said, Paul. It was YOUR choice which direction you wanted to go on this thread. I gave you two routes to take. You’re the one that decided which way to turn.
    And Hawthorne’s post? Go read the links I supplied you on the Phalanx system. Obviously, Hawthorne didn’t, and his short post is full of holes. If you would have read the information I supplied, you would have seen the holes immnediately. So don’t lecture me about “seriously wanting a rational discussion of issues”.
    And do you REALLY subscribe to the pseudo-intellectual gobbledy gook that Questions posted on the Phalanx issue?? Gads man, you gotta be kidding me.
    BTW, I see varanasi never responded to your “rational” query about his blanket accusation of “anti-semitism”. What a suprise.

    Reply

  20. varanasi says:

    oh yeah, POA. i think the hasbara may be bugging your phone. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Reply

  21. varanasi says:

    forgive me for not engaging you in ANY debate – only rock fights for you, asshole.
    further, i didn’t cut and paste my reply to outraged american. i wrote it. but you already knew that because you’re a know-it-all american, right?
    and you criticize condi for her lack of diplomacy?!
    you’re online demeanor is fascist, but i’ve been bullied by worse. you’re a classic example of all bark and no bite.
    but, keep deluding yourself. high-ranking policy makers are *definitely* reading your posts. i’m sure you’re having a tangible effect on the course of u.s. foreign policy. HAHAHAHA!!!

    Reply

  22. Paul Norheim says:

    “Now, I ask you Paul, on the last thread that turned into a
    flaming clusterfuck of ad hominem and stupidity, who among
    us was willing, has always been willing, to take the time to
    supply links, sourced opinions, and avenues of research for his
    claims?”
    True. But who among us at TWN is most inclined to harass
    anyone who doesn`t agree 100% with what you say? Do you
    seriously want a rational discussion of issues, or are you only
    capable of talking to those who lick your ass, and harass the
    rest of the bunch?
    Occasionally you are very generous, even to people whom you
    disagree with – but the next day you throw invectives at people
    who happen to disagree even slightly with what you say. If you
    don`t change your attitude, you`ll end up only “discussing”
    calmly with people who lick your shoes. I won`t be one of them.

    Reply

  23. PissedOffAmerican says:

    By the way, Paul. I put up two posts. One challenged his claim that Iran had an accelerated nuclear weapons program, and requested that he supply sourcing for that claim. In the same post, in response to his citation of actions Iran had taken against United States interests, I cited equally egregious acts that Israel has taken against our interests. In fact, Israel’s attack on one of our ships was even more egregious, as they claim to be an ally.
    In the second post, I demonstrated the absolute ridiculousness of posting in another language, as absolutely NOTHING is proven by such a post. ANYONE can copy and paste.
    But, true to form, which post did you and varanasi respond to? You had a choice Paul. So did he. You could respond to the first post, that brought up two issues directly in rebuttal to varanasi’s claims, or you could respond to the second post, which was a tongue in cheek satire on varanasi’s asinine “proof” of nationality.
    So when you once again assume your sacharin pose of being the reasonable moderator for civil discourse, I suggest you examine the choice you just made, and do a little introspection. As for varanasi, I won’t hold my breath waiting for a reasonable response to my query as to his sources, because I haven’t seen him respond to such a request yet, nor do I expect to.
    Now, I ask you Paul, on the last thread that turned into a flaming clusterfuck of ad hominem and stupidity, who among us was willing, has always been willing, to take the time to supply links, sourced opinions, and avenues of research for his claims?
    I’d tell ya to go screw yourself, but thats gettin’ old. Besides, if you don’t know where I think you can shove it by now, you’re never going to get the message. In any language.

    Reply

  24. Paul Norheim says:

    And right now, POA, I`m a bit curious as to which invectives
    you`ll trow on Hawthorn, who just argued against the use of
    Phalanx against the Hamas rockets on a thread below. I`m sure
    you are up to the job of insulting him even worse than you
    insulted questions an hour ago.

    Reply

  25. Paul Norheim says:

    Of course everybody knows that varanasi`s claim that Iran has a
    nuclear weapons program is unfounded speculation – why should
    I waste any energy on that?
    But I have to say that you really have acted like a big asshole the
    last few days. You`ve treated fellow commenters so outrageously
    bad, that you currently deserve any ad hominem attacks coming
    your way from at least half a dozen people here. You`ll get no
    sympathy from me.

    Reply

  26. PissedOffAmerican says:

    It proves that anyone can copy and paste. Wanna see me be Chinese next? Or perhaps you’d prefer me as Inuit?
    I’m not asking you to “prove” anything, varanasi. Except, once in a while you might buttress your outrageous horseshit with a link or two. You can start with this crap claim that Iran has an “accelerated nuclear weapons program”.
    Frankly, I could care less if you’re Indian, Israeli, Zwahili or Martian. Its your message that counts, and its right out of the Israeli playbook. Of course, I’m sure you have your motives for that, and you are obviously driven by some sort of zealotry that seems inexplicably similiar in delivery to past “visitors” here that read from the same playbook. One even claimed to be Incan. He “worked with Peace Now” too. What a coinky-dink, eh? An Incan Peace Now dude. Hallelujah, its a trippy world, ain’t it?
    So carry on, varanasi.
    Did you hear? The Martians have landed. Its “all over the net”.
    So, Paul, you going to jump in here with more stupidity, or are you going to respond to varanasi’s claim that Iran has an “accelerated nuclear weapons program”?

    Reply

  27. Paul Norheim says:

    Just wait, varanasi, in a couple of hours POA will realize that he
    can copy and paste my Norwegian comment as well, proving that
    I am not from Norway!

    Reply

  28. varanasi says:

    so, you copied and pasted my post. what does that prove?
    you’re a complete tool POA. a sad example of what is wrong with online discourse and the internet age.
    as i said earlier, i’m happy to respond privately to steve if he feels the need to “prove” about my identity.
    but, hell, for a fascist like you, this mccarthy-esque witch hunting is par for the course.

    Reply

  29. varanasi says:

    “resident Indian”
    i wonder what that is supposed to mean? contrary to what i was taught, i will always assume the worst of intenetions with POI, our resident fascist.

    Reply

  30. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Hey!!!! Check it out, I’m Indian too!!!
    नमस्ते ओउत्रगेद अमेरिकन:
    इ बेलिएवे ठाट यू हवे यौर फक्ट्स वरोंग. इरान कान्त्र ओच्कुर्रेड आफ्टर खोमेनी’स रेवोलुशन, रिघ्त? आफ्टर इरानिंस स्तोर्मेद थे उ.स. एम्बेसी एंड किद्नाप्पेद यौर सिविलिंस, होल्डिंग थेम इन होर्रिफिक कोन्दिशन्स फॉर नेअर्ल्य अ इयर, रिघ्त?
    इरान’स नुक्लेअर प्रोग्राम कोमेस अंडर “कांस्तंत सुपेर्विसिओं” बी थे इएए? अरे यू सयिंग ठाट थिस प्रेवेंट्स थे इरानिंस फ्रॉम एन्रिचिंग प्लुटोनियम फॉर १ -२ वेअपोंस अ इयर? पेर्हप्स मोस्ट इम्पोर्तान्त्ली, अरे यू सयिंग ठाट यू बेलिएवे इरान हस नो गोल ऑफ़ प्रोदुसिंग नुक्लेअर वेअपोंस, ठाट थे अरे ओनली पुर्सुइंग अ नुक्लेअर प्रोग्राम फॉर पासफुल पुर्पोसेस?? इफ सो, मोस्ट एक्स्पेर्ट्स एंड अनाल्य्स्ट्स वौल्ड कॉल यू नीव.
    फिनाल्ली, थैंक्स फॉर कोन्तिनुइन्ग थे ओन्गोइंग दबाते अबाउट माय इदेंतिटी. आईटी सीम्स पोइन्त्लेस्स एंड इ मुस्त से आईटी इस इन्सुल्टिंग. दोएस आईटी रेअल्ली मैटर वेयर इ’म फ्रॉम? रेगार्द्लेस, इ ऍम हिन्दुस्तानी. इ वास बोर्न इन वाराणसी एंड इ स्पेंड माय टाइम स्प्लिट बेत्वीन इंडिया, लन्दन एंड थे उ.स. विथ अ फेयर बीत ऑफ़ टाइम इन बेत्वीन ओं थे रोड.
    यू ओवेर्स्ताते थे नम्बर ऑफ़ इस्राइली’स इन इंडिया एंड यू कोंफुसे थे रासों थे काम. सम किड्स ट्रेवल तो इंडिया आफ्टर ठिर आर्मी सर्विस तो विंड दोवं, नोट तू एस्कापे थे सर्विस अल्तोगेठेर. बसेद उपों माय एक्ष्पेरिएन्के थे अरे मच मोरे इन्तेरेस्तेद इन स्मोकिंग चरिस एंड रेलाक्सिंग थान अर्गुइंग पॉलिसी इम्प्लिकतिओन्स ओं फॉरेन अफेयर्स ब्लोग्स.

    Reply

  31. varanasi says:

    in respect to iran’s accelerated nuclear weapons program, it is all over the net POI.
    http://articles.latimes.com/2008/mar/04/world/fg-irannukes4
    http://www.analyst-network.com/article.php?art_id=1366
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/01/world/main4493241.shtml
    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/JK13Ak01.html
    but then again, i’m sure that iran is only enriching uranium for peaceful purposes, right? clearly they have no interest in an atomic bomb, right?

    Reply

  32. varanasi says:

    in respect to iran’s accelerated nuclear weapons program, it is all over the net POI.
    http://articles.latimes.com/2008/mar/04/world/fg-irannukes4
    http://www.analyst-network.com/article.php?art_id=1366
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/01/world/main4493241.shtml
    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/JK13Ak01.html
    but then again, i’m sure that iran is only enriching uranium for peaceful purposes, right? clearly they have no interest in an atomic bomb, right?

    Reply

  33. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Cee….
    Its a glitch. Did you have mnmore than two links in the post?

    Reply

  34. Cee says:

    Iran sent an aid ship to Gaza? Was it stopped?
    Will this post also be held for approval?

    Reply

  35. PissedOffAmerican says:

    “i sense very little fear of iran on this board. i find this fact fascinating because it’s the same iranian leadership which stormed *your* embassy and kidnapped *your* embassy workers, right?”
    But we’re supposed to love Israel for the Liberty incident, and the espionage committed against us, right?
    And, care to link to your proof that Iran has “an accelerated nuclear weapons program?” The IAEA doesn’t believe this to be the case. You have information they don’t?
    Its comical, really, that our resident Indian gets his talking points right out of “The AIPAC Handbook of Unmittigated Horseshit”.
    I’m sure, in response to being asked for a link or source for his “accelerated nuclear weapons program” claim, he’ll stutter, and say, “Its all over the net”, as he does everytime he’s asked to collaborate his spew with something other than intellectual flatulence.

    Reply

  36. varanasi says:

    नमस्ते ओउत्रगेद अमेरिकन:
    इ बेलिएवे ठाट यू हवे यौर फक्ट्स वरोंग. इरान कान्त्र ओच्कुर्रेड आफ्टर खोमेनी’स रेवोलुशन, रिघ्त? आफ्टर इरानिंस स्तोर्मेद थे उ.स. एम्बेसी एंड किद्नाप्पेद यौर सिविलिंस, होल्डिंग थेम इन होर्रिफिक कोन्दिशन्स फॉर नेअर्ल्य अ इयर, रिघ्त?
    इरान’स नुक्लेअर प्रोग्राम कोमेस अंडर “कांस्तंत सुपेर्विसिओं” बी थे इएए? अरे यू सयिंग ठाट थिस प्रेवेंट्स थे इरानिंस फ्रॉम एन्रिचिंग प्लुटोनियम फॉर १ -२ वेअपोंस अ इयर? पेर्हप्स मोस्ट इम्पोर्तान्त्ली, अरे यू सयिंग ठाट यू बेलिएवे इरान हस नो गोल ऑफ़ प्रोदुसिंग नुक्लेअर वेअपोंस, ठाट थे अरे ओनली पुर्सुइंग अ नुक्लेअर प्रोग्राम फॉर पासफुल पुर्पोसेस?? इफ सो, मोस्ट एक्स्पेर्ट्स एंड अनाल्य्स्ट्स वौल्ड कॉल यू नीव.
    फिनाल्ली, थैंक्स फॉर कोन्तिनुइन्ग थे ओन्गोइंग दबाते अबाउट माय इदेंतिटी. आईटी सीम्स पोइन्त्लेस्स एंड इ मुस्त से आईटी इस इन्सुल्टिंग. दोएस आईटी रेअल्ली मैटर वेयर इ’म फ्रॉम? रेगार्द्लेस, इ ऍम हिन्दुस्तानी. इ वास बोर्न इन वाराणसी एंड इ स्पेंड माय टाइम स्प्लिट बेत्वीन इंडिया, लन्दन एंड थे उ.स. विथ अ फेयर बीत ऑफ़ टाइम इन बेत्वीन ओं थे रोड.
    यू ओवेर्स्ताते थे नम्बर ऑफ़ इस्राइली’स इन इंडिया एंड यू कोंफुसे थे रासों थे काम. सम किड्स ट्रेवल तो इंडिया आफ्टर ठिर आर्मी सर्विस तो विंड दोवं, नोट तू एस्कापे थे सर्विस अल्तोगेठेर. बसेद उपों माय एक्ष्पेरिएन्के थे अरे मच मोरे इन्तेरेस्तेद इन स्मोकिंग चरिस एंड रेलाक्सिंग थान अर्गुइंग पॉलिसी इम्प्लिकतिओन्स ओं फॉरेन अफेयर्स ब्लोग्स.

    Reply

  37. Outraged American says:

    Varanasi, Iran-Contra ring a bell? Look it up. Iran hasn’t started
    a war since the mid-1700s, and if she’s such a threat why are
    we selling weapons to her?
    Iran’s a signatory to the NPT, and therefore her nuclear program
    comes under constant supervision by the IAEA. INDIA IS NOT a
    signatory, nor is ISRAEL.
    I don’t mean to be rude, or start some kind of flame war, but,
    given his or her comments, I think that Varanasi might not be an
    Indian, but possibly an ex-pat Israeli. There are so many young
    Israelis living in India after fleeing Israel, usually around the time
    of their mandatory military service, that Israel considers it an
    emigration crisis.
    Prove me wrong if you would, Varanasi: tell me something that
    confirms that you’re a native Indian. Maybe write a technical
    post in Hindi, to prove that your knowledge of Hindi goes
    beyond the basics.
    As to Israelis sipping Pepsi as they watch the carnage in Gaza as
    if it were the Super Bowl, here’s the source. It’s from McClatchy,
    probably the most respected wire service in the U.S.:
    Israelis, sipping Pepsi, watch bombardment of Gaza town
    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/world/story/59013.html

    Reply

  38. varanasi says:

    JohnH wrote:
    “Iran (same–need to end non-existent nuclear weapons program)”
    you really believe that iran does not have an accelerated nuclear weapons program? wow.
    and would your opinions change if you *knew* that they did? just an interesting hypothetical question.
    i sense very little fear of iran on this board. i find this fact fascinating because it’s the same iranian leadership which stormed *your* embassy and kidnapped *your* embassy workers, right?
    further, iranian state-sponsored religious rhetoric has been damning and threatening the western world and israel for decades now.

    Reply

  39. Cee says:

    Outraged American,
    Even Daniel Pipes said he didn’t like the way Israel is waging this war.
    I only saw part of the Al-Jazeera interview. Does anyone know why he’s critical?
    Helena,
    I had always supported Israel until I became aware of the above and more.
    Read the books by Victor Ostrovsky and Patrick Seale

    Reply

  40. Helena says:

    Below is a cut and paste from comments section in Taylor Marsh’s blog which for me at least remove all doubt of Israel’s expansionist policies and desire to eradicate the Palestinian population. If the two irretractable sides can’t come together with cards on the table and their true intentions exposed, a meaningful dialogue can’t begin. I am so tired of the cowardice of the American media that won’t allow this dialogue a beginning. It’s a shame that leading Jewish intellectuals such as Noam Chomsky, recognized and lauded in Europe and elsewhere, has totally been shut out of the conversation on American media outlets.
    “Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of
    these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only
    do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of
    Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar
    Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that
    did not have a former Arab population.”
    — David Ben Gurion, quoted in The Jewish Paradox, by Nahum Goldmann, Weidenfeld and
    Nicolson, 1978, p. 99
    “We must expel Arabs and take their places.”
    — David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.
    “Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves … politically we are the aggressors and they
    defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come
    here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country.”
    — David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky’s Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha
    Flapan’s “Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech
    “We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be
    done with the Palestinian population?’ Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said ‘Drive
    them out!”
    — Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times,
    23 October 1979.
    “Israel should have exploited the repression of the demonstrations in China, when world
    attention focused on that country, to carry out mass expulsions among the Arabs of the
    territories.”
    — Benyamin Netanyahu, then Israeli Deputy Foreign Minister, former Prime Minister of Israel,
    speaking to students at Bar Ilan University, from the Israeli journal Hotam, November 24, 1989.
    “It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a
    certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no
    Zionism, colonialization, or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the
    expropriation of their lands.”
    — Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme
    right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.
    “Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge
    the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours…Everything we don’t
    grab will go to them.”
    — Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence
    France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.
    “Israel may have the right to put others on trial, but certainly no one has the right to put
    the Jewish people and the State of Israel on trial.”
    — Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, 25 March, 2001 quoted in BBC News Online

    Reply

  41. Cee says:

    Chertoff may use again so we don’t talk about Gaza
    Terror Expert Warns Next 9/11 Could Fall on a Different Date
    WASHINGTON–In an alarming development with wide-reaching implications for America’s safety, Department of Homeland Security head Michael Chertoff and CIA Director Michael Hayden issued a joint report Monday warning that the next 9/11 could in fact occur on a different date
    http://www.wikio.com/search/terror+expert+warns+next+9-11+could+fall+on+different+date

    Reply

  42. Paul Norheim says:

    Outraged American, thanks for the link.
    This article is rather short, and a must-read, so I post it here:
    “Israel using Gaza as ‘test laboratory’ for new weapon: medics
    1 day ago
    OSLO (AFP) รขโ‚ฌโ€ Israel is testing a new “extremely nasty” type of
    weapon in Gaza, two medics charged as they returned home to
    Norway Monday after spending 10 days working at a hospital in
    the war-torn Palestinian territory.
    “There’s a very strong suspicion I think that Gaza is now being
    used as a test laboratory for new weapons,” Mads Gilbert told
    reporters at Oslo’s Gardermoen airport, commenting on the
    kinds of injuries he and his colleague Erik Fosse had seen while
    working at the Shifa Hospital in Gaza.
    The two medics, who were sent into the war zone by the pro-
    Palestinian aid organisation NORWAC on December 31, said
    they had seen clear signs that Dense Inert Metal Explosives
    (DIME), an experimental kind of explosive, were being used in
    Gaza.
    “This is a new generation of very powerful small explosives that
    detonates with an extreme power and dissipates its power
    within a range of five to 10 metres (16-98 feet),” said Gilbert,
    61.
    “We have not seen the casualties affected directly by the bomb
    because they are normally torn to pieces and do not survive, but
    we have seen a number of very brutal amputations… without
    shrapnel injuries which we strongly suspect must have been
    caused by the DIME weapons,” he added.
    The weapon “causes the tissue to be torn from the flesh. It
    looks very different (from a shrapnel injury). I have seen and
    treated a lot of different injuries for the last 30 years in
    different war zones, and this looks completely different,” said
    Fosse, 58.
    “If you are in the immediate (vicinity of) a DIME weapon, it’s like
    your legs get torn off. It’s an enormous pressure wave and there
    is no shrapnel,” he explained.
    Gilbert also accused Israel of having used the weapon in the
    2006 Lebanon war and previously in Gaza, and referred to
    studies showing wounds from the explosive could cause lethal
    forms of cancer within just four to six months.
    “Israel should disclose what weapons they use and the
    international community should make an investigation,” he said,
    stressing the amount of damage apparently caused by the new
    form of explosive.
    “We are not soft-skinned when it comes to war injuries, but
    these amputations are really extremely nasty and for many of
    the patients not survivable,” he said.”

    Reply

  43. Outraged American says:

    I forgot to add that a delegation composed of European Union
    Parliamentarians went into Gaza on Saturday through Egypt via the
    Rafah crossing. They were there to see the desperate humanitarian
    crisis in Gaza themselves and will report back to the European
    Union. Egypt obviously co-operated with the EU in allowing them
    into Gaza.
    To all of you Israel apologists, international doctors in Gaza are
    reporting that new weapons are being tested on the Palestinians.
    Really horrific ones, not that any weapon that kills is not horrific.
    Israel using Gaza as ‘test laboratory’ for new weapon: medics
    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jLfdWctpr
    2BuBzTdSi3oks4THJxg

    Reply

  44. AWR says:

    Unfortunately, a post-partisan foreign policy is a pipe dream, fueled by the successor generation coming into power, particularly on Capitol Hill. Despite Dick Lugar’s best intentions, he will have a much less cordial relationship with Kerry than he did with Biden. The same has proved itself true with Howard Berman and Dan Burton. I remain somewhat hopeful, but the days of “politics stops at the water’s edge” have been gone for a long time, and will be hard to recover. Maybe Obama can do something – he is cautious to a fault – but he doesn’t have much time.

    Reply

  45. JohnH says:

    I thought we had a post-partisan foreign policy already. Where are the significant policy differences between Repugnics and Democraps?
    Iraq (same–occupy forever)
    Iran (same–need to end non-existent nuclear weapons program)
    Afghanistan (Repugnics, same; Democraps, more of the same)
    Israel (same and excessive same)
    Try and name one of Bush’s foreign policies that Democraps have significantly altered or even fought seriously to alter. You simply can’t.
    Instead of the existing post-partisan foreign policy, we need to have the parties clearly differentiate their positions.

    Reply

  46. MrMurder says:

    A Queen speaking to the item signals a change in the dialogue for the region. The USA has two female Secretaries of State aligned with the MIC and Israel. This is clearly a call to them.
    A female speaks truth to power from a moderate Muslim land.Usually in these instances, what is not said is more powerful a message. This has crossed any such threshold. This signals major change that must be adequately answered.
    Do not take her words lightly. This could accelerate a lot of progress if obligated.

    Reply

  47. Outraged American says:

    Hamas is NOT an Iranian proxy. There is no credible evidence
    that Iran has ever supplied weapons or monetary aid to Hamas,
    this per Hillary Mann Leverett on NPR last Saturday. Mann
    Leverett was on the National Security Council and is a member
    of the Council on Foreign Relations. She was also special
    Assistant to the U.S. Ambassador in Cairo, Egypt.
    I just wanted to clear the record after a post Wig Wag made in
    another comment section about Hamas being an Iranian proxy.
    In any case, the only way to get anything into Gaza after the
    Israeli blockade was either through Israel or the tunnels from
    Gaza to (wait for it…) EGYPT!!! That would suggest some
    Egyptian cooperation.
    Queen Raina of Jordan has come out strongly against this latest
    Israeli assault on Gaza and has demanded a ceasefire, which I
    doubt that she could do without her husband’s approval.
    So whatever Wig Wag heard on Al Jazeera, while some of it might
    be factual, does not represent the complexities of the politics of
    the Middle East.

    Reply

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